Pope Threatened, Churches Torched, Riots Follow Papal Remarks
The violence following the Pope's remarks on violence is spreading like wildfire...
A Somali cleric associated with the Islamist movement in that country has called on Muslims to "hunt down and kill" Pope Benedict XVI for his comments about Islam adn violence.
Muslim fanatics elsewhere threatened to carry out attacks against The Vatican, Rome and elsewhere because of the Pope's remarks. (Or, at least they say it is because of the Pope's remarks.)
Meanwhile...
Four churches were attacked in the West Bank yesterday by radical Muslims outraged at the Pope's remarks on Radical Islam.
Palestinians look at a fire at the gate of an Anglican church after it was hit by a firebomb in the West Bank city of Nablus September 16, 2006. (Reuters)
The Pope's apology is not enough for some Muslims outraged at his remarks on Muslim violence.
Another Indian cleric threatened the Pope with "devastating results" if he did not apologize.
Saudi Arabia's grand mufti called the Pope's comments "lies".
Communists joined the protests against the Pope in Uttar Pradesh, India.
Palestinian Greek Orthodox priest George Awad views black scorch marks on the walls of his church after it was hit by firebombs in the West Bank city of Nablus September 16, 2006. Unknown assailants threw fire bombs at two churches in Nablus, following a day of protests against comments Pope Benedict made about Islam. (REUTERS/Abed Omar Qusini)
The Vatican has bumped up security.
At least... One church was attacked in Basra Iraq overnight.
An Iraqi woman walks outside the Syrian Catholic church, which was attacked overnight in Basra, south of Baghdad, September 16, 2006. (Reuters)
IraqPundit has more thoughts.
Wasn't this the Pope's whole argument?
Update: Make that 5 churches torched in Gaza... still waiting to here on Egypt.
posted by Gateway Pundit at 9/16/2006 12:15:00 PM
14 Comments:
Isalm has to be the most pissed-off religion on the face of the planet. There's nothing that can be said or done that doesn't get their knickers in a twist, except of course a good suicide bombing or two, that they love.
The churches attacked aren't even Catholic.
Pope Benedict XVI's Orwellian Address at the University of Regensburg has provoked, amongst other things, a storm of gullibility.
In an address purporting to invite dialogue between cultures is embedded a cynical guarantee that there will be no dialogue.
In an address purporting to be about the evils of 'religious violence' is embedded a pricking goad towards more 'religious violence'.
In an address purporting to promote harmony between faith and reason are embedded words specifically intended to incite faith without reason.
Is the journalistic world indeed so naive as to believe that the Pope, as beneficiary of the millenial experience of the finest statesmen and strategists the earth will ever see, did not know exactly what he was doing?
Are they so naive as not to recognise that every word is meticulously weighed and measured for short and long-term efficacy before issuing from the mouth of the 'Vicar of Christ' on earth.
Loose words do not fly in the Vatican's corridors of power.
In the full knowledge of the Vatican's own long and less-than-salubrious history, the Pope guilelessly draws attention to Islamic religious violence and pretends not to have realised that this self-righteous arrogance and hypocrisy would cause Muslim outrage. Of course, one can always 'apologise' later, knowing full well that nothing can erase a single word from the minds of those to whom it was directed.
What is the strategy being employed here - the endgame?
What has happened to the 'one big happy family' policy approach to Islam? Indeed, one could be cynical enough to conclude that the past encouragement of the Muslim flooding of Europe
was just a ruse to destablise and provoke conflict to the stage where the Pope could step in as Saviour of Western Europe.
One could be even more cynical and conclude that, given his Western European heritage and his notorious intractability, Pope Benedict XV1 was chosen for that precise purpose.
We shall see...
Vynette,
"Orwellian"?
Look, I'm not Christian. I'm as far from being Christian as it's humanly possible to get. I've got no time for the Pope. But look at what the Pope actually said and look at how these nutcases are reacting -- rioting, starting fires (at non-Catholic churches), comparing him to Hitler, and all the rest of it. There's no proportionality, no logical connection, no way anyone could predict the reaction from what supposedly triggered it.
Bill Zychlewicz has it right. There's nothing anyone can say or do and feel sure that it won't set these wingnuts off. I half expect that one of these days the Islamic world is going to explode in riots because of a report that President Bush had waffles for breakfast.
No one has to use some fiendishly clever Orwellian "strategy" to provoke them. EVERYTHING provokes them. You might as well ponder what motivates or provokes a rabid dog.
vynette,
You are a fool as your post clearly illustrates.
There will never be any "dialogue" with Islam. Thier idea of "dialogue" is submit or die. They illustrate that simple fact in graphic detail on a daily basis. I know that the agenda driven and cluelly challenged such as yourself can not grasp that simple fact. It might help you to get out of the "reality-based community" and into the real world for a bit.
Islam is a religion of violence. It is one of the main tenants of their scriptures. Their whole freakinig "religion" is based on violence. All infidels must convert or die. You break any of the rules of their religion you are executed. They illustrate these simple facts in graphic detail on a daily basis. I know that the agenda driven and cluelly challenged such as yourself can not grasp that simple fact. It might help you to get out of the "reality-based community" and into the real world for a bit.
There will never be any "harmony" with Islam. Their idea of "harmony" is what you are seeing in Darfur. Their idea of "harmony" with the west is for us to submit or die.
Is the journalistic world indeed so naive as to believe that the Pope, as beneficiary of the millenial experience of the finest statesmen and strategists the earth will ever see, did not know exactly what he was doing?
Oh, apparently in your mind we should stifle all freedom of speech when it comes to Islam. I am not going to walk around on eggshells worrying about if Islamofascists are "offended". Want to know why? Because they are all "offended" that we have not submitted to them and are still breathing. You fool, hopefully you will not learn this fact as Theo Van Gogh did.
Are they so naive as not to recognise that every word is meticulously weighed and measured for short and long-term efficacy before issuing from the mouth of the 'Vicar of Christ' on earth.
Loose words do not fly in the Vatican's corridors of power.
I for one am glad to see someone finally take a stand against the barbarism of Islam in the west. The Pope has the guts to fight. Unlike the Archbishops of Canterbury and York who have done everything to kiss the Islamsts ass except convert and turn the cathedrals of York, Canterbury and Westminister into mosques. The Belgian protestant ministers have already allowed their churches to be turned into mosques.
In the full knowledge of the Vatican's own long and less-than-salubrious history, the Pope guilelessly draws attention to Islamic religious violence and pretends not to have realised that this self-righteous arrogance and hypocrisy would cause Muslim outrage. Of course, one can always 'apologise' later, knowing full well that nothing can erase a single word from the minds of those to whom it was directed.
Save the moral equivalency BS for your buddies at the mosque or Daily Kos. You think the catholic church is so bad? Take a good, freaking hard look at the history of Islam, fool. Let me ask you a question. When was the last Crusade called by a pope? 500-600 years ago. Islam has never stopped it's holy war against ALL who are not Moslems. They do not call it "the bloody borders of Islam" for nothing, fool.
What is the strategy being employed here - the endgame?
For Islam it is either you convert or die.
Simple. As. That.
What has happened to the 'one big happy family' policy approach to Islam? Indeed, one could be cynical enough to conclude that the past encouragement of the Muslim flooding of Europe
was just a ruse to destablise and provoke conflict to the stage where the Pope could step in as Saviour of Western Europe.
In order to have "one big happy family" all have to agree to be on. Islam will never agree to that.
Many in Europe are finally getting that cosmic clue. You are aware that many contries in Europe are stopping all immigration of moslems into their countries. That includes any family members of current immigrants. No more marrying someone in order to bring them and their families in, either. European countries are no starting to throw out their illegal immigrants, or jailing them. I will make a little prediction for you here. At the rate the Islamists in Europe are going you will see some good ol' fashioned "ethnic cleansing" there soon.
One could be even more cynical and conclude that, given his Western European heritage and his notorious intractability, Pope Benedict XV1 was chosen for that precise purpose.
Your Freudian slip showed in this paragraph. To quote Gandalf; "Go back to the abyss!"
Vynette, you're missing the real story. Karl Rove was behind the whole thing. He used his mind control ray to make the Pope say all that stuff and provoke another round of Islamic rioting so that everyone would be frightened into voting Republican.
And I'm sure there were aliens involved somehow. And Hitler's brain.
I have many contacts in the Middle Eastern countries in play here. In those countries the issue of Muslim expansion and the SWORD are discussed openly in those countries. It is not spoken in public and you will not see it on TV, but it is known and understood that Muslim law is the only law these people understand or will support.
If you doubt it look up the examples of what has happened to anyone who has tried to convert Islam. The word 'peaceful' not describe the Muslim law reaction to it.
I like the fact one way or the other the Pope's comments have brought more of these people out in the open and shown the world what they are really about.
Vynette
The Pope's motives are quite irrelevant. The fact that people react to words with mortal violence is completely unacceptable. I hate to use the word savages but there is not a more accurate term coming to mind to describe these people.
Does the Pope really want a dialogue with Islam?
The amende honorable of the Pope in the form of a sincere regret expressed publicly did go a long way in containing a dangerous confrontation between Islam and Christianity. But what has gone unnoticed in the chaotic imbroglio is the Pope’s invitation to a “frank and sincere dialogue” with the Muslims. Not surprisingly, the Muslims masses under the misguidance of an extremist clergy were busy burning Churches and effigies of the Pope, and killing innocent nuns to have concentrated on countering the Pope through “reason” by accepting his invitation. It is time Muslims realized that violent or emotional reaction to attacks on Islam or its prophet is not the Islamic way. Now, with the Pope emphasizing in his meeting with Muslim envoys on Monday, Sep 25 that, “the inter-religious and inter-cultural dialogue between Christians and Muslims is, in effect, a vital necessity, on which a large part of our future depends", it has become all the more necessary to engage the Church in a “sincere and respectful” debate.
A careful reading of the Pope’s Sep 12 Regensburg address reveals that his entire speech revolved around the necessity “to raise the question of God through the use of reason, and to do so in the context of the tradition of the Christian faith” and it was in this context that the Pope wanted a dialogue “over the structures of faith contained in the Bible and in the Qur'an”, … “especially with the image of God and of man, while necessarily returning repeatedly to the relationship between - as they were called - three "Laws" or "rules of life": the Old Testament, the New Testament and the Qur'an.” What are being referred to here are Judaism, Islam and Christianity. Confining ourselves to a hermeneutical discussion on Islam and Christianity, the following are some of theological issues that need to be addressed by the Pope for a meaningful dialogue with Islam.
Claiming Islam to be a continuation of the message brought by Moses and Jesus, the Quran makes categorical statements on the life and person of Christ which have profound implications for Christian theology. First of all, Islam negates the concept of the Original Sin supposedly committed by Adam and Eve that necessitated the sacrifice of Jesus on the Cross as vicarious atonement for the sins of mankind. The Quran declares that “no bearer of burdens can bear the burden of another” (6:164). The truth is that it was Paul who perpetuated the belief of salvation through the crucifixion and resurrection of Jesus (1 Corinthians 15:14) whereas Jesus himself says that God “will reward each person according to what he has done.” (Matthew 16:27). In fact the Quran challenges the very idea of crucifixion asserting that Jesus was neither killed nor crucified and that those who believe in his expiatory death “follow nothing but conjecture.”(4:157).
On the crucial issue of God the Quran strongly opposes the theanthropic status ascribed to Christ saying that he was no more than a messenger of God (4:171) and that it is blasphemy to believe in Trinity and the divine sonship of Jesus for there is only one God and it does not befit His status to sire a son and, nor does He need to beget a son (5:73-77, 19:88-92, 112:1-4). The Quran also records a future conversation between God and Jesus on the Day of Judgment wherein Jesus forcefully denies having ever claimed divinity either to either himself or his mother Mary (5:116-119). The truthfulness of this statement can be verified from the fact that in the all the four Gospels of the New Testament Jesus always refers to himself as “Son of Man” emphasizing his human nature. (Matthew 8:20, 17:22, 19:28, Mark 9:31, 14:21). Interestingly Bible editors have now excised as interpolation the word “begotten” from the oft-quoted verse John 3:16 which described Jesus as the “only begotten Son.” Not just that, the only reference in the entire Bible on Trinity in 1 John 5:7 has also been removed with the unceremonious explanation that the words “the Father, the Word and the Holy spirit, and these three are one” are “not found in any Greek manuscripts before the sixteenth century” (The N I V Quiet Time Bible, InterVarsity Press, Illinois, p.1557). It is common knowledge that the edifice of present day Christianity is based on Trinity and the begotten sonship of Christ and, with the removal of these foundational doctrines from the Bible, Christianity has come closer to the monotheism of Islam.
But how did these verses not preached by Jesus get interpolated into the Bible? Theologians such as Adolf Von Harnack believe that it was because of the strong influence of Greek Philosophy. But the Pope disagrees with Harnack’s thesis. In his Regensburg speech he disapprovingly declares, “Fundamentally, Harnack's goal was to bring Christianity back into harmony with modern reason, liberating it, that is to say, from seemingly philosophical and theological elements, such as faith in Christ's divinity and the triune God.”
Such an attempt to de-Hellenize Christianity and “to return to the simple message of the New Testament” says the Pope, “is not only false; it is coarse and lacking in precision. The New Testament was written in Greek and bears the imprint of the Greek spirit, which had already come to maturity as the Old Testament developed.” Therefore, the reluctance of the Pope to see “reason”, and with Biblical scholars of the caliber of Harnack coming to the same conclusion as the Quranic view of Christianity it has to be asked whether the Pope is really interested in a dialogue with Islam.
Kind attn editor: All quotes from the Pope are from his Sep.12 Regensburg speech.
By
A.FAIZUR RAHMAN
(Peace activist & Executive Committee member, Harmony India, an organization devoted to secularism and communal amity)
Email: a.faizur.rahman@gmail.com
Blog address: truth-for-thought.blogspot.com
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